Natural Antivirals - Elderberry caution for H5N1!

[bassman2]

Posted for those stocking their preps - a bit of a surprise for me!

http://www.the-health-gazette.com/health-gazette-blog/alternative-medicine/natural-antivirals

Natural Antivirals
Submitted by Health Gazette on Thu, 2006-05-11 08:55. Alternative Medicine
Regular readers know that I have no time for the nonsense relating to imagined bird-flu pandemics. However. I regarded the following item of sufficient novelty to be of some interest. You may judge its merits for yourself.

Research suggests certain natural foods may be as effective against virus H5N1 as commercial antivirals.

(PRWEB) May 10, 2006 -- A Biology teacher from Australia, named Stephen Jones, has done extensive research into the H5N1 virus and compiled a list of natural foods that are effective against it and listed others that are detrimental.

The list may come as a surprise to many people since foods such as spirulina and echinacea are listed as detrimental. This strange occurrence is largely due to the fact that the virus is immune to 2 cytokines that the body produces (TNF-a and IL-6). Cytokines are compounds produced by the body’s immune system that attack and remove foreign bodies. The problem is that when a foreign body is immune to certain cytokines, the body sees that its immune response is not working and tries even harder, which can lead to what is called a cytokine storm, where the body becomes flooded with these compounds and they eventually destroy the body itself. Foods such as Echinacea actually stimulate the production of these specific cytokines; hence consuming it is not a good idea if one suspects they may have the virus.

During the 1918 Spanish Flu many healthy young people died from cytokine storms due to their immune systems overreacting. Consuming foods which suppress the production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6 and enhance the production of the ones that actually are effective against the virus will aid the patient greatly.

Other foods that create mucous in the respiratory tract, such as bananas, are also listed as detrimental due to the fact that the predominant breeding ground of the virus is the respiratory tract and another way in which a patient may suffer is due to the body's over production of mucous in this area.

Folk Medicines and Herbs to use and avoid with Bird Flu

Below is a list of foods that are said to contain substances that are natural antivirals, immune boosters or they decrease cytokines TNF-a and IL-6.

Alternative medications that are most likely to help us during a severe pandemic:

Garlic (allicin) - Very effective antiviral. Best if fresh (raw) and crushed. Must be consumed within 1 hour of crushing. Dosage is initially 2 to 3 cloves per day but later reduce until no body odour occurs. No toxic effects noted. (Pubmed PMID 9049657)

Vitamin C - Boosts the immune system and is an antiviral by blocking the enzyme neuraminadase. Viruses need neuraminadase to reproduce. There are anecdotal stories of people taking large amounts of Vitamin C (children ½) surviving the Spanish Flu. Research shows that it may reduce the production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. A study on 470 people involved giving the test group 1000 mg hourly for 6 hours and then 1000 mg 3 times daily after reporting flu symptoms. Symptoms decreased by 85%. (Pubmed PMID 10543583, 634178, 16169205, 12876306)

Green Tea (possible Tamiflu/Relenza alternative)- Very effective antiviral. Also decreases the production of the cytokine (catechins) TNF-a. Inhibits neuraminidase. May have antiviral activity that is equal to other antivirals such as Tamiflu. (Pubmed PMID 16137775)

St Johns Wort (Hypericum) - Very effective antiviral. Also decreases the production of the cytokine IL-6. Hypericum is an extract from St John’s Wort. There have been some very successful field trials in commercial flocks infected with H5N1 in Vietnam. (Pubmed PMID 7857513, 11518071, 11362353, 7857513, 11518071)

Vitamin E - Immune booster. Also decreases the production of the cytokine TNF-a. (Pubmed PMID 155882360, 10929076) Experiments involved using mice. Very suitable for immune compromised people, especially the elderly. Effects enhanced when taken with Vitamin C.

Apple Juice - Antiviral. Fresh apple juice including the pulp and skin has greater antiviral activity than heated commercial apple juice. More research is needed. Effectiveness on H5N1 is unknown. (Pubmed PMID 32832, 12452634)

Resveratrol - Antiviral. In addition to inhibiting neuraminidase, Resveratrol also sends a message to cells to stop manufacturing viruses. This is a proven antiviral found naturally in red wine, peanuts, mulberries, Japanese Knotwood root (richest source), raisins and red grapes. Resveratrol supplements are relatively inexpensive, are more stable than wine and is available in liquid form for absorption in the mouth. No toxic effects noted. (Pubmed PMID 1583880, 12817628, 15985724)

Scuttellaria (Skullcap) - Antiviral. A herb used as a tea. It has no side effects and is also a mild tranquilliser. Research suggests neuraminidase, which is a substance needed by the H5N1 virus to reproduce, may be inhibited.

Cranberry Juice - Early research shows that it may be an antiviral, making viruses less able to invade or multiply. Effectiveness on H5N1 is unknown. (Pubmed PMID15781126)

Cat’s Claw (Uncaria tomentosa) - Decreases the production of the cytokine TNF-a. Also boosts immune system. The number of white blood cells was significantly increased during treatment. No toxicity was noted. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=search&DB=pubmed) Active constituents can be found in the leaves, bark, vine, and roots. Water extraction from bark used. Children and pregnant women are to avoid. Has a potentially damaging effect on the DNA of proliferating cells. (cancers, foetuses, growing children)

Curcumin (Tumeric Spice) - Decreases the production of the cytokine TNF-a. This is the yellow compound in turmeric spice. Research shows that this may be very good for preventing a cytokine storm although this is not proven. Must be taken with food or gastritis or peptic ulcers may occur. Pregnant women and feeding mothers should avoid this. The medicinal properties of curcurnin cannot be utilised when used alone due to rapid metabolism in the liver and intestinal wall. When combined with Piperine found in black pepper the absorption is increased with no adverse effects. Obtainable from health stores in tablets, liquid, capsules already combined with piperine. Dosage is 500mg to 4000mg daily.

Astragalus root (Astragali Radix) - Boosts immune system. (Pubmed PMID15588652)

Tea tree Steam Inhalation - Reduces the cytokine TNF-a. Add 2 drops of tea tree oil in a bowl of steaming water. Cover head with a towel and inhale for 5 to 10 minutes. Relieves congestion and fights infection. Its effectiveness is unknown. (Pubmed PMID 11131302)

The following substances may be best to avoid during a H5N1 pandemic

Elderberry juice (Sambucal) - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. This substance is very effective against the common flu but may not be desirable for the H5N1 virus. Increases in these cytokines may trigger a lethal cytokine storm. (Isr Med Journal2002 Nov;4:944-6)

Micro Algae (Chlorella and Spirulina) - AVOID - Increases production of cytokine TNF-a. (Pubmed PMID 11731916)

Honey - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. (Pubmed PMID12824009)

Chocolate - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. (Pubmed PMID 12885154, PMID 10917928)

Echinacea - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. Although it is often used for normal flu, research shows that it may increase the chance of cytokine storms for H5N1. (Pubmed PMID 15556647, 9568541)

Kimchi - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. (Pubmed PMID15630182)

Dairy products & Bananas - AVOID - These foods increase mucous production.

References:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/ (search using Pubmed ID number listed after each food)

[Belle]

Kimchi - AVOID - Increases production of cytokines TNF-a and IL-6. (Pubmed PMID15630182)

This contradicts empirical evidence.

[Sarah]

Extensive research show that elder stop the production of hormone-like cytokines that direct a class of white blood cells known as neutrophils to cause inflammation, especially in influenza and arthritis. On the other hand, elder increases the production non-inflammatory infection-fighting cytokines as much as 10 fold. Elder berries are known to be effective against eight strains of influenza. This suggests that elder be superior to vaccines in preventing flu, because flu vaccines are only effective against known strains of flu, whereas the virus is continually mutating to new strains. Vaccines have another draw back: over half of people who get them report side effects. Dr. Madeleine Mumcuoglu, of Hadassah-Hebrew University in Israel found that elderberry disarms the enzyme viruses use to penetrate healthy cells in the lining of the nose and throat. Taken before infection, it prevents infection. Taken after infection, it prevents spread of the virus through the respiratory tract. In a clinical trial, 20% of study subjects reported significant improvement within 24 hours, 70% by 48 hours, and 90% claimed complete cure in three days. In contrast, subjects receiving the placebo required 6 days to recover

Taken from mountain rose herb.com catalog discussions on different herbs.

[check]

Thanks

[Humble Servant]

What about what about red cider vinegar?

[packyderms_wife]

This was put out by the National Institute of Health

[momof23goats]

Interesting for sure. i am not surprised about apple juice or cranberry huice.

[check]

HS, unfiltered apple cider vinegar has a lot
of medicinal properties, we always have it stocked, the old
timers also used to take a couple chugs of it daily to keep
their immune system up. It also works as an anti-diarrheal
when other things don't. (mix a few tablespoons in a glass of water).

[Humble Servant]

Thanks !

[momof23goats]

HS, unfiltered apple cider vinegar has a lot
of medicinal properties, we always have it stocked, the old
timers also used to take a couple chugs of it daily to keep
their immune system up. It also works as an anti-diarrheal
when other things don't. (mix a few tablespoons in a glass of water).
it is also great if you have a tooth that is going bad, and getting infected. just hoold in mouth and put on tooth about 5 or 6 times a day, usually by thethird day the whole mess is clear up, great for gums too.
not good on the enamel so they say.

[snowman41]

Some comments...

Garlic is also an anti-coagulant, so if you're taking other blood thinners you need to be aware of this, because of the danger of a stroke.

White tea is better than green tea in that it has some anti-bacterial as well as antiviral properties and is also available at your supermarket. White tea is the immature tea buds with little processing.

Quality grape juice (ie Welch's) contains as much or more reservatrol than red wine. Switch to dark berry jams, etc. when you're sick for even more.

I have found these flu remedies also work as cold remedies. However, I usually add zinc tablets for a cold.

Probably safer to use a mix of many of these remedies, to kill as much of the virus as possible, while minimizing the cytokine storm effects.

Good article and thread. Thanks for posting.

Snowy

[54321...]

I keep seeing this info and no one seems to say one way or the other.
SHOULD ELDERBERRY BE TAKEN?

Is it mainly Gov. agencies saying that the elderberry is bad?

[Lilly]

I just posted that same article on another thread. I am really looking for a true defination of what type flu this is, so we know how to treat it.

Is this a true H1N1 or some mixture of others?

[Sunflower]

I have personal experience with FLU this week. My youngest child has been sick with it. He had 4 days with high fevers and headaches. He is not a toddler, but middle school age. His fevers were 103-104F with headaches, chills, poor appetite, cough with phlegm in the back of his throat. I treated his symptoms with rest, fluids and motrin. The one thing that broke the fever was apple cider vinegar. After one dose (1tsp) the fever broke and so far has not returned (aprox. 24 hours now). He is still fatigued and his cough is lingering, but he is improving. His appetite has returned. :grin:

I don't think the MSM is telling the truth, but I do think they like us to panic. We are easy to control if we panic and look to TPTB for help. jmho :grin:
__________________

[Earthsick]

just started my raw garlic regimen until this blows over (spicy in the mouth, yeesh), i'll have to grab some apple cider vinegar in case I start showing any symptoms

[Bodhi]

HS, unfiltered apple cider vinegar has a lot
of medicinal properties, we always have it stocked, the old
timers also used to take a couple chugs of it daily to keep
their immune system up. It also works as an anti-diarrheal
when other things don't. (mix a few tablespoons in a glass of water).

ACV is great stuff. It also helps with heartburn and acid reflux. Used in salads (olive oil and ACV) it can help prevent food poisoning from tainted meat. Be sure to use organic, unfiltered ACV with the mother.

[PapayaPlanter]

RE: SAMBUCOL:
I think I'm going to trust in favor of the Rabbi's and Israeli virologist on this one. I did not copy the link, and will search it out, but wanted to post it right away; especially after seeing the info on this thread.
It's grievious to not feel able to trust the .guv health organization, but after reading the georgia-stones, ... well, we are a ''arrogant'' bunch of units of consumption,.eh?
Papaya Planter


In 1995, laboratory studies were carried out at Hadassah, which showed that Sambucol was effective against human, swine and avianinfluenza strains.

Sambucol fights bird flu virus in lab
Sambucol, a standardized extract of black elderberry, has been found to fight the avian flu virus H5N1, revealed British researchers last week.
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A team at Retroscreen Virology, an institute associated with the University of London, said that the extract was at least 99 per cent effective against the H5N1 virus and significantly neutralized the infectivity of the virus in cell cultures.
`
Dr Madeleine Mumcuoglu, the Israel-based developer of Sambucol, said the good results confirmed her earlier findings on the product, which is currently marketed around the world as a natural supplement for fighting common flu.
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“It is active against lots of different types of flu viruses and I did my PhD on its effect on a non-virulent strain of bird flu so the results did not surprise me,” she told NutraIngredients.com.
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“But I’m very happy with these results, especially as the work was done by Dr John Oxford, a reputable specialist in flu,” she added.
`
Dr Mumcuoglu stressed that the results could in no way demonstrate a benefit for humans infected with the bird flu strain that has killed more than 70 people, mostly in South East Asia, since the outbreak began in 2003. Nor will she be able to test it in a human trial.
But she is looking into starting an animal trial using ferrets, which have similar flu symptoms to humans.
`
Dr Mumcuoglu added that bird flu is still a lower threat than common flu, thought to kill about 25,000 people in the UK alone each year through complications.
While the new bird flu results might boost sales of Sambucol, it is the evidence from two human clinical trials on human flu that has created a significant market for the product. The double blind, placebo-controlled studies – the first done in Israel, and the second in Norway – both found that people who took the elderberry supplement got rid of flu in half the time of the placebo group, or after two to three days compared to about six.
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Dr Mumcuoglu says Sambucol blunts the haemaglutinin spikes on the outside of viruses and stops them from entering cells where they reproduce, cause the cell to explode and allow the virus to continue invading the body.
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An in vitro study has also shown Sambucol to be effective in increasing the production of four inflammatory cytokines, suggesting that the supplement may have an immuno-stimulatory effect and therefore be worth taking all year round to prevent flu and other disease.
`
Jerusalem-based Razei Bar Industries now produces more than 1.5 million bottles of Sambucol syrup, with average growth of 10 per cent each year.
"I didn’t invent anything," claims Dr Mumcuoglu. "Elderberry has been known from the beginning of time. What people didn’t know is what the active ingredient is, how to keep it intact and how to formulate to keep it active."
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This active substance has not been patented to protect the firm's market. While several copycat products are available in healthstores, Razei Bar says it has tested several of these and found none of the active ingredient.
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The new laboratory results were presented at a press conference held in the Royal Society of Medicine, London last week. Another trial is now underway at Hadassah Medical Organization Ein Kerem in Israel.

Elderberry extract a possible cure for bird flu

A extract from black elderberries could be used to combat the bird flu virus, research suggested today.
A study looked at whether the food supplement Sambucol could combat the deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu when added to canine cells in laboratory tests.
`
The team, from research institute Retroscreen Virology, found that the elderberry-based product was at least 99% effective at reducing the virus in the cells.
But experts warned that many more studies were needed to find out whether the formula was effective in combating H5N1 in humans.
`
The virulent H5N1 strain of avian flu has already killed more than 80 people, mainly in Asia, after they contracted it from close contact with birds.
But there are fears that the virus could mutate into a form that is easily passed from human to human, leading to a flu pandemic which could potentially kill millions worldwide.
`
The main medical solutions in case of a pandemic include a vaccine, but this could take up to six months to develop once the strain emerges.

Stockpiling
Countries around the world are stockpiling antiviral drugs which can reduce the length and severity of flu symptoms.
`
The latest study by Retroscreen, which is affiliated to the University of London, looked at how effective the elderberry extract was in combating H5N1 infections in the dog kidney cells.
`
The formula was added to the infected cells and compared with samples which were just allowed to incubate the virus.
The researchers found that Sambucol was effective in significantly neutralising the virus infections in the cell cultures.
`
Effective against ordinary flu
Dr Madeleine Mumcuoglu, who developed the formula using the secret ingredient from elderberries, said that studies also showed that Sambucol could combat the ordinary winter flu.
"The flu virus cannot replicate by itself. It must do so inside a living cell.
`
"It binds to cells via hemagglutin on the virus surface.
"Sambucol blocks the hemagglutin and prevents the entry of the virus into cells," she said.
Dr Mumcuoglu said the results did not mean that the formula would be able to cure flu in humans, but it gave some hope that it may be a possible further solution if more studies supported the findings.
`
"Sambucol has been shown to be effective in the treatment of the common flu.
"It enhances the immune system and has no side effects and is backed by six scientific studies over 13 years of experience," she added.
Professor Claude Hannoun, from the Pasteur Institute in Paris, said while the results looked promising, more research was needed to confirm the effectiveness of the formula.
`
"There is a need for more studies to understand the underlying mechanisms that appear to produce this effect in flu cells.
"It could be that it complements the other tools we have to combat flu.
"But much more data has to be obtained," he said.
`
Dr Mumcuoglu is continuing to investigate the effectiveness of Sambucol against avian flu on a wider scale.
The formula, made by Razei Bar Industries Israel, is available in 17 countries around the world, including the UK.
`
The manufacturers are submitting an application to update the product's packaging in Europe to say it may be effective in combating flu.
At the moment the packaging says that it "may help maintain a healthy immune system".

Study shows Israeli elderberry extract effective against avian flu
`
At first glance, world-renowned Israeli virologist Dr. Madeleine Mumcuoglu does not seem like the sort of person you expect to come up with what could turn out to be a cure for one of humanity's biggest threats today - the avian flu.
`
She seems comfortable and grandmotherly, not the type you usually associate with the frontline of research into a potential pandemic. On the other hand, however, Mumcuoglu is clearly a very determined woman who has turned a lifetime of research into the health benefits of elderberry, an old folk remedy for influenza, into a clinically proven treatment for regular flu. Now, new in-vitro tests have proved that her remedy, the elderberry-based Sambucol, also appears to be effective against avian flu.
`
Last week, Retroscreen Virology, a leading British medical research institute associated to Queen Mary College, University of London, announced that Sambucol was at least 99% effective against the avian flu virus, H5N1, and in cell cultures significantly neutralized the infectivity of the virus.
`
"I think that Sambucol has a great role to play - it really can save lives," Mumcuoglu told ISRAEL21c. "To my knowledge, it's the only product that can cut the flu in half, before complications have a chance of setting in. If we do have a cure for chicken flu, this is a really positive thing for Israel."
`
Mumcuoglu (pronounced mum-shu-glu) was born in Algeria and immigrated to Israel in 1974. She holds a Doctorate in Virology, and studied bird flu during her Ph.D. In the 1980s, Mumcuoglu began studying the natural healing elements of the elderberry from the black elder tree (Sambucus nigra). Her interest in the plant was piqued because it had been used in medicine for many centuries. It was first referred to as a healer in the 5th century BC and received mentions in the writings of Hippocrates, Dioscurides and Plinius.
`
Elderberry wine was traditionally used for influenza and the ill effects of the chills, and the juice of the black elderberry has historically been an invaluable remedy. The elder has often been called the 'medicine chest" of the country people.
`
During Mumcuoglu's research she discovered the key active ingredient in elderberry and when she tested it against the flu virus, she found it effective. On her arrival in Israel, Mumcuoglu joined the Hebrew University Hadassah Medical Center in Jerusalem, and continued her research.
`
The result was Sambucol, a patented natural formula which contains a potent antiviral compound, AntiVirin, isolated from the black elderberry, and three flavonoids - naturally occurring plant antioxidants. In 1992, Mumcuoglu decided to commercialize her elderberry supplement, and founded Razei Bar Industries to do so.
`
Mumcuoglu, who is president of Razei Bar, first tested her research on patients in the Southern Israel flu epidemic of 1992/3. The results were extremely encouraging. Within 24 hours, 20% of those patients taking Sambucol had dramatic improvements in symptoms like fever, muscle aches and pains and coughing. By the second day, 73% were improved and by day three, 90%. In the untreated group, only 16% felt better after two days. The majority of that group took almost a week to begin feeling better.
`
In 1995, laboratory studies were carried out at Hadassah, which showed that Sambucol was effective against human, swine and avian influenza strains.
Shortly afterwards, a further randomized, double blind, placebo-controlled study was conducted in Norway, where Sambucol was shown to significantly reduce the duration of flu by approximately four days. The use of rescue medication (pain relievers, etc.) was significantly less in the group receiving Sambucol than in the placebo group. The study concluded that Sambucol stimulates the healthy immune system by increasing production of inflammatory cytokines.
`
Today Razei Bar sells a number of different liquid anti-viral treatments including Sambucol Black Elderberry Extract, Sambucol Black Elderberry Syrup, Sambucol Immune System, and Sambucol for Kids. The company also has a number of elderberry flu remedies designed for diabetics.
`
At the end of last year, Retroscreen Virology in London began laboratory tests on Sambucol to discover whether the natural remedy could also be used to combat the deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu in dog kidney cells. And their findings last week are an encouraging sign.
`
While it is too soon to know if Sambucol can cure avian flu in humans, the Retroscreen Virology trial does hold out hope that it may be a possible solution if more studies support the findings. Mumcuoglu admits that clinical research into H5N1 is impossible at this stage, because there have only been 140 or so cases around the world, and the mortality rate is over 50%. Instead, the company is preparing to begin in vivo studies to look at the effect of Sambucol against the disease caused by the avian influenza virus.
`
If Sambucol does prove effective against H5N1, it will be a major breakthrough. Unlike many of the other remedies being touted as possible treatments to bird flu, this is a tried and tested product, already on sale in 17 countries around the world, including the US, Canada, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Norway, Israel, South Korea, and Singapore.
`
In the US, Sambucol has been well received and now controls about 80% of the elderberry remedy market. The liquid food supplement is distributed by Nature's Way Products and sold in most health food stores across the country.
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A SPINS survey revealed that in the US three of Sambucol's products are among the top 10 out of 662 herbal formulas available for adults, while the children's remedy, Sambucol for Kids, is at the top of the list as the number one formula for kids out of 192 products in different categories.
`
Another advantage of Sambucol, says Mumcuoglu is that unlike the anti-viral drug Tamiflu, which is the only treatment for bird flu now available that is thought to reduce the length and severity of flu symptoms, Sambucol has no side effects. It can also be given safely to children. Tamiflu, in contrast, cannot be given to children under 12.
`
Recently there has also been doubt cast on the effectiveness of Tamiflu as two Vietnamese patients, including a 13-year-old girl, developed resistance to the anti-viral drug and died. A report on this was published in the New England Journal of Medicine. Commenting on the report in the journal, Prof. Anne Moscona of Cornell University in New York said Tamiflu-resistant H5N1 "is now a reality".
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"This frightening report should inspire us to device pandemic strategies that do not favor the development of Tamiflu-resistant strains."
The US, like many nations around the world, has stockpiled supplies of Tamiflu.
`
Another advantage of Sambucol is that it can treat every type of flu virus.
"Our research has shown that the antiviral effect of Sambucol is not strain-specific," says Mumcuoglu. "It was effective against all influenza viruses tested. The original formulation of Sambucol is the product we have tested in all cases - both in the laboratory and in clinical studies for the common flu. It is what was also used in the recent experiments in London against avian influenza virus thus any Sambucol already on the shelves is the same as any we would produce now."
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Traditional vaccines given to prevent flu from developing are often created through guesswork, with scientists simply speculating which strain of flu is likely to hit that year. The three most likely strains are combined into a vaccine, but by the time the flu season arrives, these strains may have undergone changes, or new strains may have emerged. Despite this, Mamcuoglu insists that those at risk continue to take their flu jabs.
`
Mamcuoglu insists that use of Sambucol against traditional flu viruses will help reduce the annual death rate. "If you stop the flu virus at the beginning then you stop it going to the lungs, or from creating the additional complications that are normally the cause of death," she explains.
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Currently about 30,000 people die of regular flu every year in the US, a figure that could rise alarmingly if avian flu becomes the pandemic experts are predicting. If Sambucol proves effective against bird flu, however, Mamcuoglu believes that figure will be much lower.
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The next round of trials into Sambucol's efficacy as a treatment for bird flu are likely to be completed during the year. Mumcuoglu is ready for any upsurge in sales that are likely if the results are positive. "We have additional production facilities on standby," she says.

[Summerthyme]

Guys... the most important thing to remember on this is simple:

EARLY and OFTEN.

Elderberry prevents the virus from "latching on" to your cells, and slows viral replication.

This has the effect of reducing (or KEEPING LOW) the "viral load"... the number of virii in your system.

The fewer virii in your system, the less immune over-stimulation is likely to happen.

Even if the disease has a head start, given a lack of advanced medical care, and Tamiflu or other EFFECTIVE antivirals, I'd use elderberry even in an established case... along with various remedies to help ameliorate the potential cytokine storm.

I know this is a vast oversimplification (for the medical members here), but I think it's accurate, and I hope it lays some of the concerns to rest...

Summerthyme

[curlysue]

Guys... the most important thing to remember on this is simple:

EARLY and OFTEN.

Elderberry prevents the virus from "latching on" to your cells, and slows viral replication.

This has the effect of reducing (or KEEPING LOW) the "viral load"... the number of virii in your system.

The fewer virii in your system, the less immune over-stimulation is likely to happen.

Even if the disease has a head start, given a lack of advanced medical care, and Tamiflu or other EFFECTIVE antivirals, I'd use elderberry even in an established case... along with various remedies to help ameliorate the potential cytokine storm.

I know this is a vast oversimplification (for the medical members here), but I think it's accurate, and I hope it lays some of the concerns to rest...

Summerthyme

Well said Summerthyme!

[nchomemaker]

I have quite a few quarts of elderberry extract and syrup made up. My 29 yr. old daughter is pregnant, is it safe for her unborn baby? I will give her the syrup which has very little vodka in it.

[Summerthyme]

Sigh....

There is no reason for it NOT to be safe. It's essentially a fruit syrup, after all.

Trying to figure out how to phrase this so I don't overstep my (completely non-existent, as far as "official") qualifications here:

If it was my daughter, or myself, I'd use it. IIRC (and I may not) pregnant women didn't fare well during the 1918 pandemic.

Unfortunately, if she's like my daughter, she'll ask her doctor... who won't have a freakin' clue what she's talking about and will dissuade her from using it. BTDT... it's still frustrating.

Summerthyme

[Lbuck]

Eatable berries are a FOOD. Period!:-D

[nchomemaker]

Sigh....

There is no reason for it NOT to be safe. It's essentially a fruit syrup, after all.

Trying to figure out how to phrase this so I don't overstep my (completely non-existent, as far as "official") qualifications here:

If it was my daughter, or myself, I'd use it. IIRC (and I may not) pregnant women didn't fare well during the 1918 pandemic.

Unfortunately, if she's like my daughter, she'll ask her doctor... who won't have a freakin' clue what she's talking about and will dissuade her from using it. BTDT... it's still frustrating.

Summerthyme

Thank you Summerthyme, I love you, and in my book you are qualified, I trust your wealth of wisdom. You are truely a blessing. I think my daughter will trust the advice, as she already knows elderberry to be effective against the common cold.
My concern was about the small amount of vodka in it, not the elderberry itself. I put about 10 percent of vodka in the syrup.

[Summerthyme]

I understand... it's such a miniscule amount, I wouldn't be concerned.

Alcohol in large amounts isn't good for the fetus, but that's talking ounces a day, on a daily basis.

Even if she takes pretty much the largest dose I've ever used (when hubby was running 104° with influenza, and several co-workers ended up in the hospital with pneumonia)... well, let's see:

1 ounce (30 mls) every 2-3 hours (didn't wake him up for it if he was sleeping well)... figure 7 doses a day. You're still well under a single drink's worth of alcohol for the 24 hour period... and that is a MASSIVE treatment dose, not a preventative.

Summerthyme

[nchomemaker]

She is coming to visit next weekend. I hope the flu doesn't start showing up in the area where she is lives and works. I'll give her a couple quarts of the syrup and she will start a preventive dose. I told her if people in Wilmington start getting this, to up the dose.

[PapayaPlanter]

Here is the link (and the article)

http://www.rx4betterhealth.com/sambucol/

In 1995, laboratory studies were carried out at Hadassah, which showed that Sambucol was effective against human, swine and avian influenza strains.
Sambucol fights bird flu virus in lab
Sambucol, a standardized extract of black elderberry, has been found to fight the avian flu virus H5N1, revealed British researchers last week.

A team at Retroscreen Virology, an institute associated with the University of London, said that the extract was at least 99 per cent effective against the H5N1 virus and significantly neutralized the infectivity of the virus in cell cultures.

Dr Madeleine Mumcuoglu, the Israel-based developer of Sambucol, said the good results confirmed her earlier findings on the product, which is currently marketed around the world as a natural supplement for fighting common flu.

“It is active against lots of different types of flu viruses and I did my PhD on its effect on a non-virulent strain of bird flu so the results did not surprise me,” she told NutraIngredients.com.

“But I’m very happy with these results, especially as the work was done by Dr John Oxford, a reputable specialist in flu,” she added.
Dr Mumcuoglu stressed that the results could in no way demonstrate a benefit for humans infected with the bird flu strain that has killed more than 70 people, mostly in South East Asia, since the outbreak began in 2003. Nor will she be able to test it in a human trial.

But she is looking into starting an animal trial using ferrets, which have similar flu symptoms to humans.
Dr Mumcuoglu added that bird flu is still a lower threat than common flu, thought to kill about 25,000 people in the UK alone each year through complications.
While the new bird flu results might boost sales of Sambucol, it is the evidence from two human clinical trials on human flu that has created a significant market for the product. The double blind, placebo-controlled studies – the first done in Israel, and the second in Norway – both found that people who took the elderberry supplement got rid of flu in half the time of the placebo group, or after two to three days compared to about six.

Dr Mumcuoglu says Sambucol blunts the haemaglutinin spikes on the outside of viruses and stops them from entering cells where they reproduce, cause the cell to explode and allow the virus to continue invading the body.

An in vitro study has also shown Sambucol to be effective in increasing the production of four inflammatory cytokines, suggesting that the supplement may have an immuno-stimulatory effect and therefore be worth taking all year round to prevent flu and other disease.
Jerusalem-based Razei Bar Industries now produces more than 1.5 million bottles of Sambucol syrup, with average growth of 10 per cent each year.

"I didn’t invent anything," claims Dr Mumcuoglu. "Elderberry has been known from the beginning of time. What people didn’t know is what the active ingredient is, how to keep it intact and how to formulate to keep it active."

This active substance has not been patented to protect the firm's market. While several copycat products are available in healthstores, Razei Bar says it has tested several of these and found none of the active ingredient.

The new laboratory results were presented at a press conference held in the Royal Society of Medicine, London last week. Another trial is now underway at Hadassah Medical Organization Ein Kerem in Israel.
Elderberry extract a possible cure for bird flu
A extract from black elderberries could be used to combat the bird flu virus, research suggested today.

A study looked at whether the food supplement Sambucol could combat the deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu when added to canine cells in laboratory tests.
The team, from research institute Retroscreen Virology, found that the elderberry-based product was at least 99% effective at reducing the virus in the cells.

But experts warned that many more studies were needed to find out whether the formula was effective in combating H5N1 in humans.
The virulent H5N1 strain of avian flu has already killed more than 80 people, mainly in Asia, after they contracted it from close contact with birds.
But there are fears that the virus could mutate into a form that is easily passed from human to human, leading to a flu pandemic which could potentially kill millions worldwide.
The main medical solutions in case of a pandemic include a vaccine, but this could take up to six months to develop once the strain emerges.
Stockpiling
Countries around the world are stockpiling antiviral drugs which can reduce the length and severity of flu symptoms.

The latest study by Retroscreen, which is affiliated to the University of London, looked at how effective the elderberry extract was in combating H5N1 infections in the dog kidney cells.
The formula was added to the infected cells and compared with samples which were just allowed to incubate the virus.
The researchers found that Sambucol was effective in significantly neutralising the virus infections in the cell cultures.
Effective against ordinary flu
Dr Madeleine Mumcuoglu, who developed the formula using the secret ingredient from elderberries, said that studies also showed that Sambucol could combat the ordinary winter flu.
"The flu virus cannot replicate by itself. It must do so inside a living cell.
"It binds to cells via hemagglutin on the virus surface.
"Sambucol blocks the hemagglutin and prevents the entry of the virus into cells," she said.
Dr Mumcuoglu said the results did not mean that the formula would be able to cure flu in humans, but it gave some hope that it may be a possible further solution if more studies supported the findings.
"Sambucol has been shown to be effective in the treatment of the common flu.
"It enhances the immune system and has no side effects and is backed by six scientific studies over 13 years of experience," she added.
Professor Claude Hannoun, from the Pasteur Institute in Paris, said while the results looked promising, more research was needed to confirm the effectiveness of the formula.
"There is a need for more studies to understand the underlying mechanisms that appear to produce this effect in flu cells.
"It could be that it complements the other tools we have to combat flu.
"But much more data has to be obtained," he said.
Dr Mumcuoglu is continuing to investigate the effectiveness of Sambucol against avian flu on a wider scale.
The formula, made by Razei Bar Industries Israel, is available in 17 countries around the world, including the UK.

The manufacturers are submitting an application to update the product's packaging in Europe to say it may be effective in combating flu.
At the moment the packaging says that it "may help maintain a healthy immune system".

Study shows Israeli elderberry extract effective against avian flu
At first glance, world-renowned Israeli virologist Dr. Madeleine Mumcuoglu does not seem like the sort of person you expect to come up with what could turn out to be a cure for one of humanity's biggest threats today - the avian flu.

She seems comfortable and grandmotherly, not the type you usually associate with the frontline of research into a potential pandemic. On the other hand, however, Mumcuoglu is clearly a very determined woman who has turned a lifetime of research into the health benefits of elderberry, an old folk remedy for influenza, into a clinically proven treatment for regular flu. Now, new in-vitro tests have proved that her remedy, the elderberry-based Sambucol, also appears to be effective against avian flu.
Last week, Retroscreen Virology, a leading British medical research institute associated to Queen Mary College, University of London, announced that Sambucol was at least 99% effective against the avian flu virus, H5N1, and in cell cultures significantly neutralized the infectivity of the virus.
"I think that Sambucol has a great role to play - it really can save lives," Mumcuoglu told ISRAEL21c. "To my knowledge, it's the only product that can cut the flu in half, before complications have a chance of setting in. If we do have a cure for chicken flu, this is a really positive thing for Israel."

Mumcuoglu (pronounced mum-shu-glu) was born in Algeria and immigrated to Israel in 1974. She holds a Doctorate in Virology, and studied bird flu during her Ph.D. In the 1980s, Mumcuoglu began studying the natural healing elements of the elderberry from the black elder tree (Sambucus nigra). Her interest in the plant was piqued because it had been used in medicine for many centuries. It was first referred to as a healer in the 5th century BC and received mentions in the writings of Hippocrates, Dioscurides and Plinius.

Elderberry wine was traditionally used for influenza and the ill effects of the chills, and the juice of the black elderberry has historically been an invaluable remedy. The elder has often been called the 'medicine chest" of the country people.

During Mumcuoglu's research she discovered the key active ingredient in elderberry and when she tested it against the flu virus, she found it effective. On her arrival in Israel, Mumcuoglu joined the Hebrew University Hadassah Medical Center in Jerusalem, and continued her research.
The result was Sambucol, a patented natural formula which contains a potent antiviral compound, AntiVirin, isolated from the black elderberry, and three flavonoids - naturally occurring plant antioxidants. In 1992, Mumcuoglu decided to commercialize her elderberry supplement, and founded Razei Bar Industries to do so.

Mumcuoglu, who is president of Razei Bar, first tested her research on patients in the Southern Israel flu epidemic of 1992/3. The results were extremely encouraging. Within 24 hours, 20% of those patients taking Sambucol had dramatic improvements in symptoms like fever, muscle aches and pains and coughing. By the second day, 73% were improved and by day three, 90%. In the untreated group, only 16% felt better after two days. The majority of that group took almost a week to begin feeling better.
In 1995, laboratory studies were carried out at Hadassah, which showed that Sambucol was effective against human, swine and avian influenza strains.

Shortly afterwards, a further randomized, double blind, placebo-controlled study was conducted in Norway, where Sambucol was shown to significantly reduce the duration of flu by approximately four days. The use of rescue medication (pain relievers, etc.) was significantly less in the group receiving Sambucol than in the placebo group. The study concluded that Sambucol stimulates the healthy immune system by increasing production of inflammatory cytokines.
Today Razei Bar sells a number of different liquid anti-viral treatments including Sambucol Black Elderberry Extract, Sambucol Black Elderberry Syrup, Sambucol Immune System, and Sambucol for Kids. The company also has a number of elderberry flu remedies designed for diabetics.

At the end of last year, Retroscreen Virology in London began laboratory tests on Sambucol to discover whether the natural remedy could also be used to combat the deadly H5N1 strain of bird flu in dog kidney cells. And their findings last week are an encouraging sign.

While it is too soon to know if Sambucol can cure avian flu in humans, the Retroscreen Virology trial does hold out hope that it may be a possible solution if more studies support the findings. Mumcuoglu admits that clinical research into H5N1 is impossible at this stage, because there have only been 140 or so cases around the world, and the mortality rate is over 50%. Instead, the company is preparing to begin in vivo studies to look at the effect of Sambucol against the disease caused by the avian influenza virus.

If Sambucol does prove effective against H5N1, it will be a major breakthrough. Unlike many of the other remedies being touted as possible treatments to bird flu, this is a tried and tested product, already on sale in 17 countries around the world, including the US, Canada, Britain, Holland, Belgium, Norway, Israel, South Korea, and Singapore.

In the US, Sambucol has been well received and now controls about 80% of the elderberry remedy market. The liquid food supplement is distributed by Nature's Way Products and sold in most health food stores across the country.

A SPINS survey revealed that in the US three of Sambucol's products are among the top 10 out of 662 herbal formulas available for adults, while the children's remedy, Sambucol for Kids, is at the top of the list as the number one formula for kids out of 192 products in different categories.

Another advantage of Sambucol, says Mumcuoglu is that unlike the anti-viral drug Tamiflu, which is the only treatment for bird flu now available that is thought to reduce the length and severity of flu symptoms, Sambucol has no side effects. It can also be given safely to children. Tamiflu, in contrast, cannot be given to children under 12.
Recently there has also been doubt cast on the effectiveness of Tamiflu as two Vietnamese patients, including a 13-year-old girl, developed resistance to the anti-viral drug and died. A report on this was published in the New England Journal of Medicine. Commenting on the report in the journal, Prof. Anne Moscona of Cornell University in New York said Tamiflu-resistant H5N1 "is now a reality".
"This frightening report should inspire us to device pandemic strategies that do not favor the development of Tamiflu-resistant strains."
The US, like many nations around the world, has stockpiled supplies of Tamiflu.
Another advantage of Sambucol is that it can treat every type of flu virus.
"Our research has shown that the antiviral effect of Sambucol is not strain-specific," says Mumcuoglu. "It was effective against all influenza viruses tested. The original formulation of Sambucol is the product we have tested in all cases - both in the laboratory and in clinical studies for the common flu. It is what was also used in the recent experiments in London against avian influenza virus thus any Sambucol already on the shelves is the same as any we would produce now."
Traditional vaccines given to prevent flu from developing are often created through guesswork, with scientists simply speculating which strain of flu is likely to hit that year. The three most likely strains are combined into a vaccine, but by the time the flu season arrives, these strains may have undergone changes, or new strains may have emerged. Despite this, Mamcuoglu insists that those at risk continue to take their flu jabs.
Mamcuoglu insists that use of Sambucol against traditional flu viruses will help reduce the annual death rate. "If you stop the flu virus at the beginning then you stop it going to the lungs, or from creating the additional complications that are normally the cause of death," she explains.
Currently about 30,000 people die of regular flu every year in the US, a figure that could rise alarmingly if avian flu becomes the pandemic experts are predicting. If Sambucol proves effective against bird flu, however, Mamcuoglu believes that figure will be much lower.
The next round of trials into Sambucol's efficacy as a treatment for bird flu are likely to be completed during the year. Mumcuoglu is ready for any upsurge in sales that are likely if the results are positive. "We have additional production facilities on standby," she says.
The company also has another interesting product in the pipeline, called ArteryCare 40 Plus. This is an antioxidant formula containing strong antioxidants from the elderberry, the pomegranate and the persimmon. It helps avoid the formation of plaque in the arteries by preventing the oxidation of LDL (the bad cholesterol), and is thought to also have anti-aging properties.


Elderberry Fights Flu Symptoms
http://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/news/20031222/elderberry-fights-flu-symptoms
Jelly, Jam, or Wine Won't Help -- Only Extract Works
WebMD Health NewsDec. 22, 2003 -- Sambucol, a black elderberry extract, appears to short-circuit flu symptoms, a new study shows.

This is more evidence that this herbal treatment for flu -- if taken when flu-like symptoms first appear -- could help people get through this year's flu invasion a bit easier.

However, Andrew Weil, MD, director of the program in integrative medicine at the University of Arizona, is cautious. The findings on Sambucol are only preliminary, he says. He advises people to take prescription drugs if they get the flu, but notes that Sambucol may help.

"Sambucol is for treatment, not for prevention," Weil tells WebMD. "It has an unknown mechanism of action. Research suggests it inactivates the flu virus, but we don't know that for sure."
The flu drugs Tamiflu and Relenza are used for the treatment of the flu, if the symptoms have been present for no more than two days. They can also cut flu severity and shorten illness if taken soon after flu symptoms appear. Background on Black Elder

In folk medicine, flowers from the black elder bush have been used to ease flu symptoms, colds, and sinus problems. In recent years, researchers have begun formal studies of Sambucol -- a formulation of elderberry extract -- to better understand this herbal remedy.

A small study published five years ago showed that 93% of flu patients given Sambucol were completely symptom-free within two days; those taking a placebo recovered in about six days. However, the study took place during an outbreak of influenza B -- so it was unclear whether Sambucol worked with type A virus.

This current study shows that, indeed, it works for type A flu, reports lead researcher Erling Thom, with the University of Oslo in Norway.

Thom's findings were presented at the 15th Annual Conference on Antiviral Research in 2002. The study has been accepted for publication in the Journal of International Medical Research.

The study involved 60 patients who had been suffering with flu symptoms for 48 hours or less; 90% were infected with the A strain of the virus, 10% were infected with type B. Half the group took 15 milliliters of Sambucol or and the other group took a placebo four times a day for five days.

Patients in the Sambucol group had "pronounced improvements" in flu symptoms after three days: Nearly 90% of patients had complete cure within two to three days. Also, the Sambucol group had no drowsiness, the downside of many flu treatments.

The placebo group didn't recover until at least day six; they also took more painkillers and nasal sprays.

It's likely that antioxidants called flavonoids -- which are contained in the extract -- stimulate the immune system, writes Thom. Also, other compounds in elderberry, called anthocyanins, have an anti-inflammatory effect; this could explain the effect on aches, pains, and fever.

Elderberry extract could be an "efficient and safe treatment" for flu symptoms in otherwise healthy people and for those with compromised immune systems, such as the elderly, Thom adds.

Russell Greenfield, MD, a leading practitioner of integrative medicine and medical director of Carolinas Integrative Health, advocates treating flu with black elderberry, he says in a news release. "It can be given to children and adults, and with no known side effects or negative interactions," he says.

"But don't expect grandma's elderberry jam" to ease flu symptoms like body aches, cough, and fever, he warns. "Sambucol is the only black elderberry preparation shown effective in clinical studies."

[Bethshaya]

Is this in regard to H5N1 - which is avian flu, or the current swine flu, which is H1N1? Or both?

Just want to make sure there isn't confusion on which influenza strain we are talking about, they aren't the same. We shouldn't assume what works or doesn't work on one, has the same or doesn't have the same effect on the other.

Is Elderberry Extract found proven for H1N1 Swine flu (not that I don't think it is worth it to try anyway), but all these articles posted above only reference avian flu.

[goatlady]

bethshaya, Elderberry has been proven on ALL Influenza A and B types and ALL HN flus ARE type A which = Avian - they originate in birds, then transfer/mutate via swine and humans, so YES elderberry would be as effective on the H1N1 as it is on the H5N1 or any other HN combination. As the above article states "This current study shows that, indeed, it works for type A flu," The numbers with the HN designate the different combinations of avian, swine and human flu virii. Most all the current research is being done on the H 5N1 cause it's such a virulent proven killer flu and is already resistant to 2 out of the 4 available antiviral meds and it was showing some resistance to TAmiflu in Korea towards the end of their problems with it.

[JHill45]

If I come into contact w/ H5N1--I will stay away from those products/herbs.

Since this 'swine flu' is listed as H1N1 (and there is no current vaccine) I will include several of the items listed.

[HeritageDoc]

I questioned the source of the article knocking Elderberry Extract before I even read it because it was posted through (PRWeb) instead of a news source with some weight behind them.

For $40 anybody can post anything on PRWeb and it's basically used by light-weights realesing cheesy press releases trying to sell products. Used to be free to post there until they became better known.

[packyderms_wife]

Is this in regard to H5N1 - which is avian flu, or the current swine flu, which is H1N1? Or both?

Just want to make sure there isn't confusion on which influenza strain we are talking about, they aren't the same. We shouldn't assume what works or doesn't work on one, has the same or doesn't have the same effect on the other.

Is Elderberry Extract found proven for H1N1 Swine flu (not that I don't think it is worth it to try anyway), but all these articles posted above only reference avian flu.

The current flu is swine - avian - human, in other words ALL THREE and IIRC it's swine A and swine B variants, not just one.

Kimberly

[Summerthyme]

They've tested sambucus nigra (the active herb in sambucol, and the homemade syrup or tincture) on all the various basic strains of flu.

It's effective against all of them, at least in vitro . Since it's also been proven against several strains in vivo, it's safe to assume it will work against this strain as well.

Summerthyme

[Southwind]

The current flu is swine - avian - human, in other words ALL THREE and IIRC it's swine A and swine B variants, not just one.

Kimberly

One Avian, two swine and a human. (blend for thirty seconds and pour over ice) Sounds like a recipe, doesn't it?
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.424c5b4c93103272a5d7bbabb402fde a.c1&show_article=1

[LMonty]

we have discussed the possible issues with cytokine increase in other forums when initially doing the research for potential interventions. one of the most important things to remember is that the higher the viral load (more viruses in the body) the greater the chance of cytokine storm.

so reducing viral load -or keeping it low to begin with- is very important to decreasing the chance of cytokine storm.

I'm personally beginning to take homemade elderberry elixer starting today, twice a day as a prohylaxis. I have curcumin and several other interventions that reduce inflammatory cytokines- the inflammatory ones are the ones implicated in storm. If I get any symptoms, fever, cough sneezing etc- then I'll go to much higher doses and switch my homemade elderberry elixer to sambucol. Reason I'm starting this now is that even though there arent any suspect cases mentioned in the news yet, I'm a nurse, and likely to be in contact with it before it makes the press....

why I decided this- Because the elderberry has been shown to both decrease the chances of an exposure taking hold as an infection, and to reduce viral load if it does. I'll switch from the homemade to the proprietary Sambucol in case of infection since thats the one that has been proven in studies to decrease the flu symtoms and duration. I'm starting DH on elderberry prophylactically also, since the chances are I could bring home the virus and share it before I even knew I was sick. Or he could get exposed in the community and bring it home himself. I'm not sure yet- but if it goes dormant in the summer, I may stop the elixer for awhile, probably a couple of weeks after the last cases are reported.

a quick personal anecdotal report on effectiveness of sambucol- about 3 yrs ago, DH had a friend staying with us a few days to help tile the new kitchen floor. He woke with the flu the second or third day he was there- the real deal, 104 fever, cough, diarrhea, vomiting etc. I started him on Sambucol immediately, at treatment doses per the label directions. the second day his temp ran in the low 100.x and the third day he was afebrile, eating normal, tiling the kitchen,saying he felt fine...just a little tired. Went out for a couple of beers after dinner....

His boss, who started with symptoms within a few hours of him was at his own home- no sambucol. He had 103-104 fever for 4 days, full blown symptoms and was out sick a week. He shared it with his family. Neither DH or I got the flu, I had started both of us on sambucol as prophylaxis as soon as I realized what was happening. Also used high doses of Vit C, multivits, and curcumin, and for the sickie- tylenol alternated with motrin for his fever. Plenty of fluids for all of us....

Certainly just the usual human flu- and this is just anecdotal evidence...but the above real life example was pretty convincing for me. Realizing that preventing a high viral load may be the most improtant thing we can do, elderberry makes sense to me. Knowing that the cytokines it boosts arent the inflammatory kind helps, and having other supplements (curcumin with bioperene, Omega 3's, antioxidents etc) to decrease inflammation and the possibility of tissue damage if some occurs seems like the type of approach that has the best chance of working.

If youve got a couple of hours :) theres more research on possible interventions in this thread than you can shake a stick at:
http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=14854&page=1&pp=40&highlight=therapeutic+interventions

No guarantees. We are in uncharted territory.

[Annie Maude]

Is the only way to get the elderberry syrup to make it, or can you order it from a reputable source?

[Summerthyme]

AnnieMaude... there are several sources. Google "Sambucol" or do a search here... several have posted links to where they are buying it.

DO NOT get any product which contains Echinacea or other immune system boosters. That unfortunately rules out the wonderful product from Todd's Honey Gardens, which otherwise I recommend without reservations. But NOT FOR THIS FLU.

Edited to add: I just posted a simplified version of my "recipe" for the homemade syrup in the Kitchen thread started by Goatlady on Elderberry. Believe me- if you can make ANYTHING in the kitchen, you can make this stuff!

Summerthyme

[AnnieOakley]

Is the only way to get the elderberry syrup to make it, or can you order it from a reputable source?

This is not my forte but I picked up some Rapid Relief Black Elderberry Syrup at the healthfood store. It is super concentrated....hope it will do until my shipment of elderberries come in.

[AnnieOakley]

AnnieMaude... there are several sources. Google "Sambucol" or do a search here... several have posted links to where they are buying it.

DO NOT get any product which contains Echinacea or other immune system boosters. That unfortunately rules out the wonderful product from Todd's Honey Gardens, which otherwise I recommend without reservations. But NOT FOR THIS FLU.

Edited to add: I just posted a simplified version of my "recipe" for the homemade syrup in the Kitchen thread started by Goatlady on Elderberry. Believe me- if you can make ANYTHING in the kitchen, you can make this stuff!

Summerthyme

Thanks for all your valuable info you have shared here.