Keeping His Commandments

[Look4Truth]

Description: Explaining the New Covenant

[CaryC]

Hey 9er,

I get what you are saying, and agree the NEW Covenant didn't come into force until the Cross.

I was curious about this:

Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

I wondered if that statement was looking to the destruction of the Temple. Hebrews, written in 68 AD meant the Temple was still standing, along with the sacrifices, and would continue for another 2 years. However, the sacrifices, and Temple was ready to vanish away, which it did 2 years later.

Would like to hear your thoughts. Here are a couple of commentaries remarks on it:

Cambridge:

Hebrews 8:13
he hath made the first old] The very expression, “a New Covenant,” used in the disparaging connexion in which it stands, superannuates the former covenant, and stamps it as antiquated. The verse is a specimen of the deep sense which it was the constant object of Alexandrian interpreters to deduce from Scripture. The argument is analogous to that of Heb_7:11.
Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away] Lit. “Now that which is becoming antiquated and waxing aged, is near obliteration.” The expression “near evanescence “again shows that the Epistle was written before the Fall of Jerusalem, when the decree of dissolution which had been passed upon the Old Covenant was carried into effect. Even the Rabbis, though they made the Law an object of superstitious and extravagant veneration, yet sometimes admitted that it would ultimately cease to be—namely, when “the Evil Impulse” (Deu_31:21) should be overcome.
ready to vanish away] Comp. the expression “near a curse” (Heb_6:, and Dr Kay points out the curious fact that “curse” and “obliteration” (aphanismos here alone in the N. T.) appear in juxtaposition in 2Ki_22:19 (where our version renders it “desolation”).

From Clarke:

That which decayeth and waxeth old - Here is an allusion to the ancient laws, which either had perished from the tables on which they were written through old age, or were fallen into disuse, or were abrogated.
Is ready to vanish away - Εγγυς αφανισμου· Is about to be abolished. Dionysius of Halicarnassus, speaking of the laws of Numa, which had been written on oak boards, says: Ἁς αφανισθηναι συνεβη τῳ χρονῳ· “which had perished through old age.” And the word αφανιζειν is used to express the abolition of the law. The apostle, therefore, intimates that the old covenant was just about to be abolished; but he expresses himself cautiously and tenderly, that he might not give unnecessary offense.
When the apostle said, All shall know the Lord, from the least to the greatest, under the new covenant, he had copious authority for saying so from the rabbins themselves. In Sohar Chadash, fol. 42, it is said: “In the days of the Messiah knowledge shall be renewed in the world, and the law shall be made plain among all; as it is written, Jer_31:33, All shall know me, from the least to the greatest.” We find the following legend in Midrash Yalcut Simeoni, part 2, fol. 46: “The holy blessed God shall sit in paradise and explain the law; all the righteous shall sit before him, and the whole heavenly family shall stand on their feet; and the holy blessed God shall sit, and the new law, which be is to give by the Messiah, shall be interpreted.”
In Sohar Genes., fol. 74, col. 291, we find these remarkable words: “When the days of the Messiah shall approach, even the little children in this world shall find out the hidden things of wisdom; and in that time all things shall be revealed to all men.”
And in Sohar Levit., fol. 24, col. 95: “There shall be no time like this till the Messiah comes, and then the knowledge of God shall be found in every part of the world.”
This day are all these sayings fulfilled in our ears: the word of God is multiplied; many run to and fro, and knowledge is increased; all the nations of the earth are receiving the book of God; and men of every clime, and of every degree - Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites; the dwellers in Mesopotamia, in Judea, in Cappadocia, in Pontus and Asia, Phrygia and Pamphylia, in Egypt, in Libya; strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes; Cretes and Arabians; Americans, Indians, and Chinese - hear, in their own tongues, the wonderful works of God.

I see L4T got a couple of post in, and her views would be welcome also.

[Forty9er]

Hey 9er,

I get what you are saying, and agree the NEW Covenant didn't come into force until the Cross.

I was curious about this:



I wondered if that statement was looking to the destruction of the Temple. Hebrews, written in 68 AD meant the Temple was still standing, along with the sacrifices, and would continue for another 2 years. However, the sacrifices, and Temple was ready to vanish away, which it did 2 years later.

Would like to hear your thoughts.

Yes, I think that is what the verse from Hebrews is talking about. From Acts 21:20 we know that many of the Jewish converts to Christ were "zealous" of the Law and were continuing to observe all of the Law. So even though, in reality, the authority of the Law for Christians had ended many were continuing to live their lives as though it had not and that was possible until the Temple was destroyed. And with that destruction it would finally be clear that the Old Covenant, along with the Law, had completely vanished away and been replaced by the New Covenant.

And Hebrews makes it clear that even with the Temple still standing there could no longer be a sacrifice for sins under the sacrificial system of the Law and those sacrifices were essential to the functioning of the Law.

[CaryC]

Yes, I think that is what the verse from Hebrews is talking about. From Acts 21:20 we know that many of the Jewish converts to Christ were "zealous" of the Law and were continuing to observe all of the Law. So even though, in reality, the authority of the Law for Christians had ended many were continuing to live their lives as though it had not and that was possible until the Temple was destroyed. And with that destruction it would finally be clear that the Old Covenant, along with the Law, had completely vanished away and been replaced by the New Covenant.

Thanks, agreed.

[Look4Truth]

Yes, I think that is what the verse from Hebrews is talking about. From Acts 21:20 we know that many of the Jewish converts to Christ were "zealous" of the Law and were continuing to observe all of the Law. So even though, in reality, the authority of the Law for Christians had ended many were continuing to live their lives as though it had not and that was possible until the Temple was destroyed. And with that destruction it would finally be clear that the Old Covenant, along with the Law, had completely vanished away and been replaced by the New Covenant.

And Hebrews makes it clear that even with the Temple still standing there could no longer be a sacrifice for sins under the sacrificial system of the Law and those sacrifices were essential to the functioning of the Law.

Well, it seems they find it convenient to pretend to keep the Law anyway so I'm sure that won't be a bother.

[dmatic]

I will ask again: Which of God's holy, just, perfect, righteous, applicable laws do you find offensive? And how do you justify disobeying Jesus' command to not keep, and teach others not to keep, even the least of God's commandments?

[CaryC]

I will ask again: Which of God's holy, just, perfect, righteous, applicable laws do you find offensive? And how do you justify disobeying Jesus' command to not keep, and teach others not to keep, even the least of God's commandments?

They are not offensive, just not able to keep. Do I need to go over the Law of Aerodynamics again?????? What kind of grade did you get in reading comprehension in HS anyway?

[dmatic]

They are not offensive, just not able to keep. Do I need to go over the Law of Aerodynamics again?????? What kind of grade did you get in reading comprehension in HS anyway?

Why are you not able? You can do all things through Christ who strengthens you! I still don't get your aerodynamics analogy. Sorry I am so dimwitted. Don't mean to offend you.

[dmatic]

OK, Cary, which commands do you find you are unable to keep?

[Pastor Guest]

OK, Cary, which commands do you find you are unable to keep?

You break one, you've broken them all.