"Two" witnesses have long been testifying, but mankind is just now getting interested

[watchman]

Eccl 1:10
10 Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us. (KJV)

Deut 30:19
This day I call heaven and earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live.


The Word spends all its time on merely two subjects. The Creation and The Creator. All other thoughts within it are merely sub topics on those two subjects.

All choices must therefore be one or the other, ie either the creation or the Creator.

The choices both man and the Creator calls government.

A government is the system or group of people governing an organized community.

Now The Living Word (Creator) said to Pilate (creation)...

"My Kingdom is not of this world (creation)"

To this both heaven and earth are witnesses.

Deut 30:19
This day I call heaven and earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live.

Note: the witnesses have already been called by the Law.

Heaven and Earth potentially contain many individual witnesses.

And in this final trial that is ongoing they are called to testify to what they have both seen and heard.

Deut 19:15
One witness is not enough to convict a man accused of any crime or offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.

I Jn 5:
7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

8 And there are three that bear witness on earth: the Spirit, the water, and the blood; and these three agree as one.

Rev 11:3
And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

The two are heaven and earth, and the word witnesses is plural, thus more than one in each...

and indeed, together they control operations on both heaven and earth.

Rev 11:6
These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy:

and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. (KJV)

shut heaven?

Rev 8:1
And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

how long does the beast reign?

Rev 17:12
12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

what are waters?

Rev 17:15
15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

waters turned to Blood?

Lev 17:
14 For it is the life of all flesh; the blood of it is for the life thereof: therefore I said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh: for the life of all flesh is the blood thereof: whosoever eateth it shall be cut off.

Rev 17:
6 And I saw the woman drunk with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the witnesses of Jesus. And when I saw her, I wondered greatly

So... after the trial?

Eccl 3:18
18 I said to myself concerning the sons of men, "God has surely tested them in order for them to see that they are but beasts."

Heaven and earth are in the process of testifying now.

why else are mankind eating their babies? read the news.

Who is trying to stop it? read the news.

Yep the testimony is going on as we speak. live with it we must?

the sides have long been chosen, and you are either on one side or the other. there are only two choices this time.

the era of 'none of the above' or 'no opinion' is finis.

Isa 43:9-11
9 Let all the nations be gathered together, and let the people be assembled: who among them can declare this, and shew us former things? let them bring forth their witnesses, that they may be justified: or let them hear, and say, It is truth.
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. (KJV)

[The Cub]

Eccl 1:10
10 Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us. (KJV)

Watchman,

I started to read your post, but could not get past your first citation. You continue to post isolated citations without expounding upon them, leaving the reader to guess at your point.

It would appear that you hold that all teaching ceased after Eccl 1:10. That is astonishing.

That would mean that the rest of the Bible, viz. the balance of Ecclesiastes through the Revelation of John are null and void. Yet, further down in your post you include citations from books that were written after Eccl 1:10. Confusing.

Would that also include Luther’s mythical “Scripture Alone” teaching (which is no where to be found in the Bible)?


It appears as though you point is that all prophecy ceased after Eccl 1:10….but I am still perplexed in that in scanning your post I see that you include citations from books written after Eccl 1:10, suggesting otherwise.


Depending upon your answer to the first question above, I have a related question for you in respect of the book of Daniel. Consider the following:

Dan 8:26 The vision of the evenings and the mornings that has been told is true. As for you, seal up the vision, for it refers to many days from now.'

Dan 12:4 But you, Daniel, keep the words secret and the book sealed until the time of the end. Many shall be running back and forth, and evil shall increase.'

In view of your position quoted above, how do you account for the subsequent unsealing of the secret words in the 2 citations above? Who is going to unseal the secret words, and how and when are they going to do so?


And there are the curious words of Joel in respect of the End Times:

Joe 2:28 Then afterwards I will pour out my spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, and your young men shall see visions.
Joe 2:29 Even on the male and female slaves, in those days, I will pour out my spirit. (Same verse in other bibles is: Jl 3:1-2)

It would appear as though at the time of Joel, much more prophesying was anticipated.


And then there is the directive of St. Paul, written after the Ascension of Jesus into Heaven:

1Th 5:19 Extinguish not the spirit.
1Th 5:20 Despise not prophecies.
1Th 5:21 But prove all things: hold fast that which is good.

I would emphasize that this is not a recommendation, but a directive.

And he reiterates:
1Ti_4:14 Do not neglect the gift that is in you, which was given to you through prophecy with the laying on of hands by the council of elders.


In 1 Corinthians, St. Paul emphasizes that among the gifts of the Holy Spirit is the gift of prophecy. This would indicate that his statements in 1 Thesalonians and 1 Timothy above, were not mistakes.

1Co 12:7 To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.
1Co 12:8 To one is given through the Spirit the utterance of wisdom, and to another the utterance of knowledge according to the same Spirit,
1Co 12:9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit,
1Co 12:10 to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another the discernment of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues.
1Co 12:11 All these are activated by one and the same Spirit, who allots to each one individually just as the Spirit chooses.


Further, we see in the Apocalypse of John, that it is God who is speaking through the prophets (Emphasis Added):
Rev 19:10 Then I fell down at his feet to worship him, but he said to me, 'You must not do that! I am a fellow-servant with you and your comrades who hold the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.'


And then there are the many other citations re: prophecy, some of which follow:

Luk_1:67 Then his father Zechariah was filled with the Holy Spirit and spoke this prophecy:

Act_21:9 He had four unmarried daughters who had the gift of prophecy.

Rom 12:5 so we, who are many, are one body in Christ, and individually we are members one of another.
Rom 12:6 We have gifts that differ according to the grace given to us: prophecy, in proportion to faith;

1Co_14:6 Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I speak to you in some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching?

1Co_14:22 Tongues, then, are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers, while prophecy is not for unbelievers but for believers.


Keep in mind that the new revelation is one thing; while the subsequent expounding upon existing revelation is another.

Can man put a bridle upon God?

[watchman]

Hmm,,, well try this.

Eccl 1:10
10 Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us. (KJV)

The above verse is just as true as it always was, and will remain.

The song sung by the redeemed (witnesses) is the song of Moses, which was written in the law before they entered the land. It is very old by todays standards, but IT HAS NEVER CHANGED. (and never will)

Rev 14:1-3
1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. (KJV)

Here’s the “New Song”

Rev 15:2-3
2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
3 And they sing the SONG OF MOSES the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints. (KJV)

For those who have not read it it is Deu 32. You can either learn it now or later… your choice, but if one wishes to be present on that sea of glass, you would do well to learn it.

The song is introduced and identified as such in the last verse of Deu 31

Deut 31:
30 And Moses spake in the ears of all the congregation of Israel the words of this song, until they were ended. (KJV)

As to where we are now, the witnesses are summarizing here: The false and newly sprung up 'gods' to Christians are simply denominations. There are a BUNCH of them.

Deut 32:17-20
17 They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up, whom your fathers feared not.
18 Of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful, and hast forgotten God that formed thee.
19 And when the LORD saw it, he abhorred them, because of the provoking of his sons, and of his daughters.
20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith. (KJV)

So, friend, there is no part of the Word that is old, or misplaced. There are two steps which lead to Wisdom. They are Knowledge, and Understanding. Mankind has the knowledge to read the Word, but lacks access to understanding, because as Is said--

James 4:1-7
1 What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don't they come from your desires that battle within you?
2 You want something but don't get it. You kill and covet, but you cannot have what you want. You quarrel and fight. You do not have, because you do not ask God.
3 When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.
4 You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
5 Or do you think Scripture says without reason that the spirit he caused to live in us envies intensely?
6 But he gives us more grace. That is why Scripture says: "God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble."
7 Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

Yep, as God through Moses Spake, The two witnesses have spoken. Their message is not going to change. It is the Souls who must change..

Hope this helps..

Watchman

[The Cub]

No, not a bit.

If I understood your point correctly.....it is a non sequitor.

See my earlier post.