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Thread: Does God have a wife ?

  1. #1
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    Default Does God have a wife ?

    Some people describe Mary, the mother of Jesus, as the beloved spouse of the Holy Spirit.

    Some Christians believe that the Holy Spirit was enraptured by Mary's beauty, so that he exclaims in admiration: "How beautiful art thou, My Love!" Cant. 4:1

    Others address the topic in such a way; he who originates the whole universe out of nothing is in no need of a son. Offspring are needed by mortals as an extension of their existence and they are needed by the weak who want help and by the dull who can invent nothing. Moreover, we know how procreation takes place. Anyone who desires offspring must have a mate or a female consort from his own species. How, then, can God have a son when He has never had a consort, and when He is one, single, and has no similarities with anyone or anything?

    What's your opinion ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gawaher View Post
    Some people describe Mary, the mother of Jesus, as the beloved spouse of the Holy Spirit.

    Some Christians believe that the Holy Spirit was enraptured by Mary's beauty, so that he exclaims in admiration: "How beautiful art thou, My Love!" Cant. 4:1

    Others address the topic in such a way; he who originates the whole universe out of nothing is in no need of a son. Offspring are needed by mortals as an extension of their existence and they are needed by the weak who want help and by the dull who can invent nothing. Moreover, we know how procreation takes place. Anyone who desires offspring must have a mate or a female consort from his own species. How, then, can God have a son when He has never had a consort, and when He is one, single, and has no similarities with anyone or anything?

    What's your opinion ?

    God is not part of himself. God is the beginning and the end, Alpha and Omega. He is fulfilled in all things, exists outside of our concepts of time, space, and unlimited by all the concepts and confusions we are afflicted by. He is complete, therefore no "sex" is necessary. There is no need for another half.

    Yeshua was born of a virgin, to be the perfect man, and the perfect sacrifice, free of original sin. These things are necessary for us, not for God.
    He was made flesh to live as a man, and sinned not, despite the continual temptation to do so, in order to fulfill the law and atone for our ridiculous and continual failures to abide in the word of the Lord, and free us from condemnation which we are fully due under the law.

    Christ came from God, the Word of God, to save us. He lived and died, and his blood was poured out on the alter of sacrifice to give us Life, having paid the price for our sins.
    Europe used to have empires. They were run by emperors.
    Then we had kingdoms. They were run by kings.
    Now we have countries...

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    The Old Testament is filled with symbolism that Israel is God's wife and Israelites are God's children. See Ezekiel 16 for example which is filled with such symbolism, including symbolism of God's consummation of His marriage with Israel [Ezekiel 16:8.]

    When Israel split into two kingdoms, God had TWO wives. See Jeremiah 3. God divorced the Northern Kingdom, Assyria destroyed it and the vast majority of Israelites were forced out of the holy land and those Israelites became "gentiles" [the word gentiles means nations] beginning in the 8th century BC. God did not divorce the Southern kingdom... but He did punish them with the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple and captivity to Babylon. Jesus Christ was born from the portion of the Southern kingdom Israelites who returned to the holy land.


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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    God divorced the Northern Kingdom, Assyria destroyed it and the vast majority of Israelites were forced out of the holy land and those Israelites became "gentiles" [the word gentiles means nations] beginning in the 8th century BC.
    It simply isn't true that the Israelites became the "gentiles". Israel in captivity is always distinguished from the nations to which she was sent and the remnant of Israel will ultimately be gathered from the nations and returned to the Land of Israel:

    Jer 31:7 For thus says the LORD, “Sing with gladness for Jacob, and shout for the chief of the nations: publish, praise, and say, ‘LORD, save your people, the remnant of Israel.’
    Jer 31:8 ’Behold, I will bring them from the north country, and gather them from the uttermost parts of the earth, along with the blind and the lame, the woman with child and her who travails with child together: a great company shall they return here.
    Jer 31:9 They shall come with weeping; and with petitions will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by rivers of waters, in a straight way in which they shall not stumble; for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.’”
    Jer 31:10 Hear the word of the LORD, you nations, and declare it in the islands afar off; and say, “He who scattered Israel will gather him, and keep him, as shepherd does his flock.”
    Ezek 28:25 ”Thus says the Lord GOD: ‘When I shall have gathered the house of Israel from the peoples among whom they are scattered, and shall be sanctified in them in the sight of the nations, then shall they dwell in their own land which I gave to my servant Jacob.
    Ezek 28:26 They shall dwell securely therein; yes, they shall build houses, and plant vineyards, and shall dwell securely, when I have executed judgments on all those who do them despite all around them; and they shall know that I am the LORD their God.’”
    And the New Covenant is made with both houses, Israel and Judah, united as one nation and returned to their own land:

    Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come,” says the LORD, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
    Jer 31:32 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they broke, although I was a husband to them,” says the LORD.
    Jer 31:33 ”But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” says the LORD: “I will put my law in their inward parts, and in their heart will I write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people:
    Ezek 37:21 ”Say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Behold, I will take the sons of Israel from among the nations, where they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:
    Ezek 37:22 and I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all; and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all;

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    Quote Originally Posted by Forty9er View Post

    It simply isn't true that the Israelites became the "gentiles".


    It is true. The vast majority of Israelites had sinfully rebelled and followed false gods... so God divorced them and they were forced out of God's holy land en masse in the 8th century BC and they became "gentiles" [ie, nations.]

    As I said, the word, gentiles means nations. Abraham was to be the father of many "nations" [Genesis 17:5-8]. The word, nations here is the same word for gentiles. This is why God forced most of the Israelites out of the holy land as punishment for their sinful rebellion... so they would eventually grow their population far beyond tiny Palestine. They would expand into Asia Minor and Europe and become many nations.... then later they would become Christian when Jesus sent His disciples to search for His lost sheep. Russian Christian tradition says St Andrew was the first to Christianize the territory of the Rus/Slavs... that is why St Andrew is the patron saint of Russia.

    Jesus said He was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel [Matthew 15:24.] Jesus said His sheep would hear Him and follow Him and they did [John 10:27.] Jesus also said He had two sheepfolds [a small one in the holy land and a much larger one abroad in the diaspora] [John 10:16, John 7:35.]

    Paul talked about the wild olive branch that would be grafted back on the olive tree. Olive is a Biblical symbol for Israel [Romans 11.]

    Jesus' Israelite disciples were called Christians first at Antioch [Acts 11:26.]

    James 1:1 addressed all 12 tribes of Israel living abroad in the name of Jesus Christ.


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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    It is true.
    You completely ignored the verses that I quoted which clearly refute what you are claiming. And you ignored them because there is no way to fit them into your false teaching other than trying to completely distort their clear meaning.

    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    As I said, the word, gentiles means nations. Abraham was to be the father of many "nations" [Genesis 17:5-8].
    You need to look at where those verses are referenced in the NT:

    Rom 4:16 For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace, to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed, not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all.
    Rom 4:17 As it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations.” This is in the presence of him whom he believed: God, who gives life to the dead, and calls the things that are not, as though they were.
    Gal 3:7 Know therefore that those who are of faith, the same are children of Abraham.
    Gal 3:8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you all the nations will be blessed.”
    Gal 3:9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed with the faithful Abraham.
    Abraham became the father of many nations only because all those who have a faith like his, regardless of their ancestry, are considered "children of Abraham". This is confirmed by the following verse:

    Gal 3:14 that the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Christ Jesus; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
    The "Gentiles" who have believed don't receive the blessing of Abraham because they are of his physical seed but because they are of his spiritual seed through faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    This is why God forced most of the Israelites out of the holy land as punishment for their sinful rebellion... so they would eventually grow their population far beyond tiny Palestine. They would expand into Asia Minor and Europe and become many nations....
    Hollow assertions with no history or Scripture to back them up.

    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    Paul talked about the wild olive branch that would be grafted back on the olive tree. Olive is a Biblical symbol for Israel [Romans 11.]
    You should read those verses in Rom 11 again. It doesn't say the the wild olive branches would be grafted "back" on the olive tree. It says only that the wild olive branches were grafted on only after the natural branches were broken off. The wild branches, which represent the Gentiles, were never on the olive tree to begin with. Only the natural branches which had been broken off (unbelieving Israel, the physical seed of Abraham) will be grafted on to the tree again.

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    I have left pearls of wisdom here for those able to understand their value.
    For those who are unable, no amount of talmudic debate will compensate.


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    Quote Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
    I have left pearls of wisdom here for those able to understand their value.
    For those who are unable, no amount of talmudic debate will compensate.
    It's interesting how you use Paul's words to justify your "pearls" of bigotry but Paul actually had no problem clearly identifying who Israel was and who the Gentiles were:

    Rom 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who did not follow after righteousness, attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith;
    Rom 9:31 but Israel, following after a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law.
    Rom 9:32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone;
    And BTW, here is the correct definition from Strong's of the Greek word translated as "Gentiles":

    a race (as of the same habit), that is, a tribe; specifically a foreign (non-Jewish) one (usually by implication pagan):—Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

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