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Thread: Basement Fallout Shelter

  1. #11
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    Default sheet lead

    http://www.rotometals.com/Lead-Sheet...FYoDQAodFBD54A


    This is one site found by googling sheet lead. Price will scare ya. Don't know how thick is needed but I would guess 1/4".
    Nessie and Bigfoot 2016. Change you can believe in.

  2. #12
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    Lead that canbe hung on studs and drywalled is on a millimeter or so in thickness.
    This is adequate for low level emf radiation under about twohundred fifty Kev. That is the energy level of x rays and low level therapy radiation. It's wholly inadequate for the Mev levels of radiation
    that fallout has. For protection from Mev level energy the lead would have to be measured in cm or inches, not millimeters. The weight would make it impossible to use in construction.

    The best protection is cheap mass......like dirt or concrete. Two to three feet of dirt or at least six to ten inches of concrete. However distance works also, doubling distance from the source quarters the dose,doubling it again quartrs the dose again. If you are in the basement of a three story house fallout that settles on the roof is twenty feet away. This could mean that six to eight inches of wet sand would be plenty of barrier....AT THAT DISTANCE. The closer you are to where the fallout is the more mass you need inbetween.
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  3. #13
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    its getting interesting, and i thank you all. independant, i had thought about the sheet lead also, on searching some prep forums had seen where others had done it in different thicknesses. i was considering it for lining ceiling panels for the basement (unfinished ceiling right now) but at this point we are slim on income.

    thanks 1911 for the link, that is helpful, i need to check that book again.

    thanks grower for the timing info, so it seems that timing may be more important than trying to find a safe level......as time passing will result in the lower levels we are looking for. i kinda hate assuming things tho, wish i could find a number.

    so say 72 hrs in shelter with as complete sheltering as possible and not going outside it for any reason, then another 7-10 days staying in shelter with minimal going outside and only IF necessary. lets give it a good 2 weeks then. unless there are any secondary explosion after the first causing even more fallout to drift our way, we can eyeball 2 weeks as a safe time to expect to stay in shelter. perhaps sleeping in the basement for an additional few weeks but being able to go out a bit more.

    i read about before going into a basement for shelter to put things on the floor of the above level, like books, lay furniture flat, anything etc, to put some mass above you. again, not perfect but a step in the right direction and is probably the only thing i can do.

    i seem to remember reading some stories a very long time ago over at frugals by a guy called tired old man--he was very good.

    i kinda remember one of his stories about preparing for sheltering for a nuke attack, his story has his family going inside to survive, etc, and monitoring radiation but the thing that i have stuck in my mind was he made some kind of spread sheet on excel for determining safe level to exit shelter, moving back into house and living above ground, etc. he seemed like a very smart an thorough kinda guy adn wrote cool stories. im not a member anymore of frugals or id go back and see if i could look it up. i think that is where i got the figure of .01 reading, to wait until going outsdie for anything.

    id bet most of us could shelter in place or find a quick shelter, but knowing when it is safe to come out/stay out is the key.

    maybe its just better to plan on at least 2-4 weeks and keep taking readings.

    personally i kinda thinks its possible for some dirty bomb to be set off here in our country by some crazy people at some time and i think that is the most intricate to prepare for. from reading the stuff on shanes site i know it can be done and i feel fairly confident our basement can be made a decent shelter. but its the coming out afterwards that im pondering on. im not seeing much info on that. i dont want to be someone who only half investigates such a subject like this.

    so far its looking like this to me

    first 72 hours---shelter in safest area with as much mass around you as possible. dont go outside for any reason. have what you need on hand to get thru this time period, water, food, bedding, potty, personal hygiene stuff, books, flashlights, batteries, radio and maybe a bottle of canadian hunter.

    first 2 weeks--remain in shelter, only going out very briefly IF really necessary to check on animals, house, etc

    next 2 weeks--can go out to take care of any necessary business, but keep on sleeping in shelter to reduce accumulation of any additional exposure of low level radiation

    continue monitoring and watch out for any secondary blasts bringing fresh fallout at any time

    ok, here is another thing im thinking on.....if we are in our basement and staying there, what about the rest of the house? will fallout dust get in thru the wood stove chimney, sift thru the windows?

    if so will it just decay fast enough that after the 4 weeks we just vacumn it up so we can live upstairs? will it contaminate the wood stove? do we tape plastic up? anyone think on this?

    i cant find any info on that either.

    i appreciate picking your brains folks.
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  4. #14
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    As far as where to buy the sheet lead...I am a plumbing contractor and on rare occasion we use sheet lead for our vent pipes that go out of the roof of the house. I called my plumbing supplier and asked him where he buys the sheet lead and I went over to the place and bought it myself. It was much cheaper 6 years ago than it is now.
    If anyone is still interested in buying sheet lead, I would either look up metal companies in the phone book or call a local plumbing supply house and ask them where you could but it.
    I have extra sheet lead to lay on top of the wood floor above us.I would have to lay it right on top of the carpet in that room. You need to use a utility knife to cut through it and it is pretty easy to work with.
    FYI, I also bought Israeli gas masks for the whole family at Uncle Sams which is a camping/hunting prepping business. Good luck all.We're gonna need it.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    Edmund Burke

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvscanman View Post
    Two to three feet of dirt or at least six to ten inches of concrete.
    36 inches of dirt is what I read.
    IF you are willing & obedient , you shall eat the good of the land: But if you refuse & rebel, You shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it. Isaiah 1:19, 20

  6. #16
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    Also, don't forget to have iodine pills on hand in case of a nuclear catastrophe.Iodine pills will keep your thyriod gland from absorbing the radiation from a nuclear blast and you can buy the iodine pills on-line.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    Edmund Burke

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by independent View Post
    Also, don't forget to have iodine pills on hand in case of a nuclear catastrophe.Iodine pills will keep your thyriod gland from absorbing the radiation from a nuclear blast and you can buy the iodine pills on-line.
    Potassium Iodide pills will only prevent thyroidal uptake of isotopic Iodine.
    This can help decrease the incidence of thyroid cancer. However many make
    the false assumption that "iodine pills" are some panacea that will save them
    from radiation if they take them.

    As for what is the "safe level" to monitor for prior to leaving shelter.....
    there are no hard and fast numbers. It's a matter of risk vs benefit.
    It would do ALL preppers well if they were to take their survey meters
    NOW and start measuring and recording the background radiation in their
    AO as it is currently. That way you will have a baseline to work from.

    Counts per minute are useful but only as an indication of activity based
    against a known baseline. That's why it's useful to know what's normal
    for now.

    Meters that read in R or mR if calibrated correctly are better at giving you
    answers on what is or isn't safe. The generally accepted numbers used
    in radiation safety and the amount that is the legal limit in many US locales
    is 5mR per hour. That is the most that can legally be measured in an area
    that is open and uncontrolled and can be accessed by the public. Measurements
    above that level require traffic control or other means of mitigation.

    A level of 5mR per hour would require a constant exposure at that rate of 1000
    hours or approximately 41 days to reach an exposure of 5 REM/RAD.

    5R is the maximum dose I am allowed to be exposed to for one calendar year
    as an occupationally exposed worker dealing with radiation. The guidlines are
    that the dose to the general public who is not occupationally exposed is 10%
    of the occupational dose. That is .5R per year. Average background for most
    Americans is .25R/yr to .4R/yr.

    It would be safe to say that most humans can survive a dose of 10R/yr easily
    especially if the dose is spread out over time and not instantaneous. Even
    an instant dose of 10R is not going to cause any overt symptoms. The risk
    is mathmatical and comes in the form of a statistical increase in the chance
    of developing cancer in the future.

    One must reach a threshold of about 50R of exposure in a short time frame
    before overt symptoms will likely become apparent....for some that number
    might be closer to 100R. Radiation exposure that is spread over time instead
    of all at once decreases the incident of overt symptoms but does
    little to diminish the long term risks of cancer over time.
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzy View Post
    im not a member anymore of frugals or id go back and see if i could look it up.
    Not sure what happened to Frugal's, but they are not there anymore. you can find some old archives at
    http://www.frugalsquirrels.com/cgi-b...ultimatebb.cgi

    I have seen this excel spreadsheet mentioned before also, but I have never found a copy of it.

  9. #19
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    Frugals moved several years ago and when they moved they did not take the fiction with them so no more good stories there.

  10. #20
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    This is an interesting thread. I too have a basement, and one side is 'open' to a two car garage. I'm thinking that making a small area 'in-the-back' away from the open doors will probably work ok. I hope.

    So.....how about the air exchange? Anybody have some thoughts on that? I'm almost inclined to try and rig up some 'new' RV sewer line (4", 25ft) to a battery powered mattress inflator. Maybe run two of them 'in-line' and put some type of filter at the end. Thinking, thinking......

    Yep, I think that I'll buy some of that stuff and try it out.

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